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May 08, 2018

1. Call to Order

Mayor Martin Tully called the regular meeting of the Village Council of the Village of Downers Grove to order at 7:00 p.m. in the Council Chambers of the Downers Grove Village Hall.

Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag

Mayor Tully led those present in the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.

2. Roll Call

Council Attendance (Present):  Commissioner Walus, Commissioner Earl, Commissioner Waldack, Commissioner White, Commissioner Barnett; Mayor Tully

Absent:  Commissioner Hosé

Non-Voting:  Village Manager David Fieldman, Village Attorney Enza Petrarca, Village Clerk April Holden

The Council meeting is broadcast over the local FM radio station, WDGC. In addition, a tape recording and videotape of the meeting are being made using Village-owned equipment. The videotape of the meeting will be used for later rebroadcast of the Council meeting over the Village cable television Channel 6. 

The Council will follow the rules of conduct for this meeting as provided in Sec. 2.5 of the Downers Grove Municipal Code. These offer the public the opportunity to comment at several points in the meeting. First, immediately following approval of the minutes of past meetings, an opportunity will be given for public comments and questions of a general nature. If a public hearing is scheduled for this meeting, an opportunity is given for public comments and questions related to the subject of the hearing. Finally, an opportunity is given for public comments and questions on items appearing on the Consent Agenda, the Active Agenda and the First Reading. 

The Mayor stated that at the appropriate time the presiding officers will ask if there are any comments from the public. Individuals wishing to speak, should raise their hand to be recognized and, after acknowledgment from the presiding officer, approach the microphone and state their name. Remarks should be limited to five minutes, and individuals are asked to refrain from making repetitive statements.

Mayor Tully said there are agendas located on either side of the Council Chambers, and he invited the audience to pick up an agenda and follow the progress of the Council meeting.

3. Minutes of Council Meetings

MIN 2018-7757 - A. Minutes:  Council Minutes - May 1, 2018


Motion:  Commissioner White moved to approve the minutes as presented.  Commissioner Waldack seconded the motion.

Mayor Tully declared the motion carried by voice vote.   

4. Public Comments

This is the opportunity for public comments.

1. Shantel Smith, 4611 Drendel, expressed her disappointment at the decision to remove from consideration the sidewalks on the south side of Drendel Road.  She explained that the petition presented to the Council does not have the support of everyone on the block. Ms. Smith said that the Transportation and Parking Commission recommendation was to install sidewalks. She discussed the safety concerns of her block, and added that the sidewalk brings a sense of community to their street. She asked that the Council reconsider its decision.

Mayor Tully replied that there has been no final decision made as yet. There was a policy in the Village that a sidewalk would be installed if the neighbors submitted a petition. Some people were very much against sidewalks on Drendel. The Village doesn't want to pit neighbor against neighbor. The Village attempted to put together a plan that would accommodate various perspectives. This is not final. Staff will be putting a bid before the Council. He noted that the Council and staff have had a fair amount of input on this topic from residents and other governmental bodies. He explained that it is not always possible to make everyone happy in situations such as this, but the Village will work toward doing the best it can.

2. Jackie Olkiewicz, 4506 Drendel, expressed the neighbors' desire for connectivity in their neighborhood. There are concerns about safety and access. There are a lot of young children in the neighborhood. She explained that winter is dangerous when the plows come through, causing people to need to walk in the street.

Mayor Tully responded that the Village would try to achieve a good outcome.

3. Carol Bufe, 4619 Drendel, thanked the Council for addressing the stormwater concerns. She addressed the pedestrian traffic, delivery trucks, U-turn issues and general safety concerns on their block. She expressed her opinion that the "rustic feel" mentioned by a neighbor at a February Council meeting does not address their safety concerns. Children and walkers need and deserve a safe place to walk, as do the commuters. She thanked the Village for its time and consideration, and noted that the residents are thinking about what their neighborhood will look like 10-15 years from now.

4. Aaron Cates, 2537 Indianapolis Avenue, expressed his concerns about the need for sidewalks for both safety and connectivity. He said neighbors have spent two years compromising and attempting to come up with a plan for sidewalks, drainage, and roadway resurfacing. Not everyone agreed with all items, and now they've removed the sidewalks from the plan. He stressed that compromises have already been made

5. Consent Agenda

BIL 2018-7758 - A. Bills Payable:  No. 6392, May 8, 2018


MOT 2018-7746 - B. Motion:  Authorize a Three-Year Contract for $363,563.00 with M.E. Simpson Co., Inc., Valparaiso, IN, for Fire Hydrant Maintenance and Flow Testing Services

Summary:  This authorizes the execution of a three-year contract for fire hydrant maintenance and flow testing services to M.E. Simpson Co., Inc. of Valparaiso, Indiana in the amount of $363,563.00.


MOT 2018-7747 - C. Motion:  Authorize a Three-Year Contract for $194,600.00 to M. E. Simpson Co., Inc., Valparaiso, IN, for Water Distribution Valve Assessment Services

Summary:  The authorizes a three-year contract for water distribution valve assessment services to M.E. Simpson Co., Inc. of Valparaiso, Indiana in the amount of $194,600.


MOT 2018-7748 - D. Motion:  Authorize $1,914,264.48 to A Lamp Concrete Contractors, Inc., Schaumburg, IL, for the 2018 Water Main Improvements Contract A

Summary:  This authorizes a contract for the 2018 Water Main Improvements Contract A to A Lamp Concrete Contractors, Inc. of Schaumburg, Illinois in the amount of $1,914,264.48.


MOT 2018-7749 - E. Motion:  Authorize $1,682,500.36 to Austin Tyler Construction, Inc., Elwood, IL, for 2018 Water Main Improvements Contract B

Summary:  This authorizes $1,682,500.36 to Austin Tyler Construction, Inc., Elwood, IL, for 2018 Water Main Improvements Contract B.


MOT 2018-7760 - F. Motion:  Authorize $32,769.00 to CDW Government, LLC, Vernon Hills, IL, for 180 Windows 10 Enterprise Operating System Licenses

Summary:  This authorizes the purchase of 180 Windows 10 Enterprise operating system licenses to upgrade computer licenses in order to manage the devices via network policy.


MOT 2018-7756 - G. Motion:  Authorize $32,250.00 to Hancock Engineering, Westchester, IL, for 2019 Water Main Survey Services

Summary:  This awards a contract for survey services to Hancock Engineering of Westchester, Illinois in the amount of $32,250.00 for Community Investment Program (CIP) project WA-028.


RES 2018-7763 - H. Resolution:  Authorize the Disposal of Personal Property Owned by the Village of Downers Grove

Summary:  This authorizes the disposal of surplus vehicles. 




MOT 2018-7767 - I. Motion:  Authorize an Amount Not to Exceed $22,000.00 to Zeigler Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram of Downers Grove, IL, for the Purchase of a Vehicle for Police Operations

Summary:  This authorizes the Village Manager to approve the purchase of a used vehicle from Zeigler of Downers Grove up to an amount of $22,000.


MIN 2018-7768 - J. Minutes:  Note Receipt of Minutes of Boards and Commissions

Summary:  Liquor Commission - April 5, 2018


Motion:  Commissioner White moved to approve the Consent Agenda as presented.  Commissioner Waldack seconded the motion. 

Votes:  Yea: Commissioners White, Waldack, Walus, Earl, Barnett; Mayor Tully

Nay: None

Mayor Tully declared the motion carried.

6. Active Agenda

ORD 2018-7745 - A. Ordinance:  Authorize a Loan Agreement with the Illinois Environmental Protection Agency

Summary:  This authorizes a loan agreement between the Village of Downers Grove and the Illinois Environmental Protection Agency. 



Motion:  Commissioner White moved to adopt "An Ordinance Authorizing a Loan Agreement between the Village of Downers Grove and the Illinois Environmental Protection Agency," as presented.   Commissioner Waldack seconded the motion. 

Votes:  Yea: Commissioners White, Waldack, Walus, Earl, Barnett; Mayor Tully

Nay: None

Mayor Tully declared the motion carried.


ORD 2018-7753 - B. Ordinance:  Amend the Rates Charged for Water

Summary:  The amends the Municipal Code regarding the rates charged for water. 



Motion:  Commissioner White moved to adopt "An Ordinance Amending the Rates Charged for Water," as presented.   Commissioner Waldack seconded the motion. 

Commissioner Barnett explained that this ordinance is a pass-through expense based on an increase to the Village from the DuPage Water Commission.

Votes:  Yea: Commissioners White, Waldack, Walus, Earl, Barnett; Mayor Tully

Nay: None

Mayor Tully declared the motion carried.

7. First Reading

RES 2018-7752 - A. Resolution:  Grant Historic Landmark Designation for 1323 Maple Avenue

Village Manager Dave Fieldman asked Stan Popovich, Director, Community Development, to address the first item.

Stan Popovich, Director, Community Development, explained that this resolution would grant landmark designation to the property at 1323 Maple Avenue. He displayed a map showing the location of the property that has a bungalow-style home built around 1924. The home is 1-1/2 stories in height with deep overhangs, a recessed entryway and a detached garage. The home meets the criteria for landmark status, and would be the 22nd home landmarked in the Village. He noted that the garage on this property is included in the landmark designation request.

Mayor Tully t Mayor Tully thanked the Millers for bringing this forward for consideration for landmarking.

Amy Gassen, 5320 Benton, expressed her support for this petition. She explained that the homeowners were unable to be present for this meeting.

Rich Kulovany, 6825 Camden, expressed his support for this petition. It is a wonderful home both inside and out. He noted that this was a custom-built home, and is a gem in the Village with elements of the Chicago Craftsman-style Bungalow with a tapestry brick exterior.


ORD 2018-7759 - B. Ordinance:  Amend the Wine Boutique Liquor License Classification

Village Attorney Enza Petrarca explained that the proposed ordinance amends the existing ordinance in that the W-1, Wine Boutique license classification, would be amended such that the primary business would be the sale of both wine and/or beer, and would also include food service. This amendment would eliminate the need for a kitchen. The Liquor Commission recommended removal of the food service all together. They also forwarded a positive recommendation to the Village Council

Mayor Tully said this came forward as an opportunity to encourage businesses in town that had a wine boutique ordinance. This amendment will allow craft beer. He noted that almost all of the Village's liquor licenses require that food be available for purchase. That does not necessarily mean that the food must be prepared on site. He suggested that if there is an interest in removal of the food service it be considered during the long-range planning discussions.

Commissioner White said he supports this amendment, and doesn't want to postpone this due to the food service issue.

Commissioner Waldack read Sec. 3.2 of the Liquor Ordinance - Purpose.  He said sometimes they get caught up in the auxiliary issues. The Commissioner noted that Downers Grove had a reputation of being dry, and that establishments served more food than alcohol. Then the size of the servings, training of staff, and other issues came under consideration. He opined that the Village is off-track. Food has a strong effect on preventing intoxication and helps enforce the purpose of the ordinance. It does not matter where the food comes from. He said he would like to see this discussed at the Long Range Planning and let the Liquor Commission know and have a discussion on this. He thinks they need to tighten up the rules regarding food.

Mayor Tully noted that only two ordinances do not require food. He is reluctant to remove food from the ordinances and thinks it is important to keep the food requirement as it serves a good purpose.  He takes seriously the sale and consumption of alcohol in the Village, and he noted that the petitioner is not requesting removal of the food requirement.

Commissioner Waldack indicated he would support this, as did Commissioner Earl.

Commissioner Barnett added his support and thanked the petitioner and the Liquor Commission. He spoke about economic development and those who want to start businesses. The change is to attempt to reflect the economy and how businesses can start, grow or expand in the Village. The Village is still determined to be respectful of its residents and the needs of the business community.


Commissioner Walus said she favored this amendment as it may bring new and different businesses to the Village.


ORD 2018-7761 - C. Ordinance:  Amend Provisions of Chapter 9, Office of Emergency Management

Ms. Petrarca explained that this is a housekeeping ordinance to reflect the roles of the Mayor and the Village Manager.  It clarifies their roles and is consistent with State law and current practices.


MOT 2018-7750 - D. Motion:  Authorize $2,792,999.76 to K-Five Construction Corp., Westmont, IL, for 2018 Street Resurfacing Contract B

Nan Newlon, Director, Public Works, explained that staff typically brings two contracts to the Council for street maintenance. This year they are bringing one contract that represents 35 street segments and includes crack sealing, seal coating services, preservative seal and roadway patching. She displayed a list of the streets effected by the construction, and noted that the same list is available on the Village's website. K-Five Construction has worked in the Village previously and was the low bidder.

8. Mayor's Report

1.    Mayor Tully extended congratulations to Public Works Director Nan Newlon for being named one of the top ten national Public Works Leaders of the Year by the American Public Works Association. It is no surprise and he thinks it is time the rest of the country recognizes her excellence as well.

2. The Mayor then mentioned the Cornerstone Awards that are awarded annually at the Downers Grove Economic Development Corporation annual luncheon. The luncheon is dedicated to the economic development of the Village. Recipients of the award will be announced at the luncheon to be held on May 11.

3. Mayor Tully extended Happy Mother's Day wishes to Commissioners Walus and Earl and all those Moms in the audience and at home.

9. Attorney's Report

Pursuant to Section 2.5 of the Downers Grove Municipal Code, the following are presented for Village Council consideration:


  1. An ordinance amending the wine boutique liquor license classification
  2. An ordinance amending provisions of Chapter 9, Office of Emergency Management


10. Council Member Reports

Commissioner Waldack expressed Happy Mother's Day wishes to all of the Mothers in the Village, and he extended his congratulations to Public Works Director Nan Newlon for her well-deserved recognition. It is great to receive national attention.

Commissioner Walus announced that West Suburban Living has a feature article for the upcoming Rotary Fest. She sent Mother's Day wishes to all Village Moms.

Mayor Tully noted that there are only 44 days left until the next Rotary Grove Fest.

The Mayor then asked for a show of hands from audience members as to those interested in the stormwater management discussion that was scheduled for the Committee Room. Due to the number of people present for that meeting, there will be a brief recess to move all the pertinent equipment from the Committee Room to the Council Chambers.

11. Manager's Report

Mayor Tully asked for a motion to recess to discuss potential amendments to stormwater management regulations. 

Motion: Commissioner White moved to recess.  Commissioner Waldack seconded the motion.

The Mayor declared the motion carried by voice vote and the Council recessed at 7:42 p.m.


REP 2017-7624 - A. Report:  Discuss Potential Amendments to Stormwater Management Regulations

Mayor Tully reconvened the meeting at 7:54 p.m.  He asked Village Manager Dave Fieldman to introduce the item.

Mr. Fieldman introduced the issue, which is code-compliant development can generate runoff that sometimes negatively impacts adjacent properties. He explained that the discussion tonight would not result in the passage of a new ordinance or final decisions. He then reviewed the two major objectives for the project.

1)  Reduce the negative impacts of runoff.

2)  The permitting process should accommodate residential renovation and redevelopment.

Challenges to the Village for stormwater management include: 1) Lack of a stormwater infrastructure; 2) Development pressures in underserved areas; 3) Properties subdivided prior to regulations; 4) Rolling topography or flat topography; 5) Soil conditions with high clay content resulting in low infiltration; 6) Resident and neighbor expectations; 7) Achieving a balance of the two major objectives.

Mr. Fieldman noted that the Village Council gave staff direction to prepare a draft ordinance, which has been done. In addition, staff was directed to meet with the builder community including real estate developers, architects, and engineers for their feedback on the draft ordinance. The meeting with the builder community was held recently resulting in many comments from representatives. Those comments included 1) that the Village should construct a modern stormwater system funded by all residents to address the infrastructure issue; 2) regulations will negatively impact property values resulting in a decrease in the number of new homes or building additions; 3) detention basins contemplated will not effectively manage stormwater for several reasons, but primarily due to the soil conditions mentioned under challenges.

The Manager then reviewed the following key points of the draft ordinance. Detention will be required for all new single-family houses and any major additions to existing structures that expand the footprint of the house and alter it by 600 square feet or more. The detention required for those projects would depend upon connections to the public system. If the public system is within 200' or less from the property and the connection is a gravity-based system, detention basins must be connected to the public drainage system.  Otherwise the owner would have to provide additional storage volume between 110%-150%, which would vary based on soil conditions. Mr. Fieldman explained that two other components would be the removal of the local amendment regarding post construction best management practices (PCBMP's) such as rain gardens and dry wells when the net new impervious area on a parcel increases by 700 square feet or more, and revert back to the DuPage County ordinance that requires installation of PCBMP's at 2,500 square feet of net new impervious area. The last point would be to provide detention for all other developments at 5,000 square feet of net new impervious area.

Staff chose to analyze the comment regarding effectiveness of the basins by reviewing 21 soil reports on file. In reviewing those reports, they determined that about 60% of properties have "good" infiltration rates, with 40% having "bad" infiltration rates. Staff thinks about 60% of the basins will likely perform as designed or intended, while about 15% will likely not perform well and will fill up and not draw down.  That leaves 25% of the basins that are likely to perform at less than designed capacity and will fill up partially, based on the elevation of the outlet pipe/public system. 

The Manager explained that his comments summarize what has been discussed and reviewed to date. He noted that staff looks to the Village Council for direction as to the next steps.

Mayor Tully thanked Mr. Fieldman for the summary, and reiterated that this is another step and no decisions will be made at this evening's meeting. The Village and staff have tried to review various ways to address the issue and are committed to trying to improve the situation.  He stressed that it is basically a balancing act.  He referenced previous less expensive steps taken that have not worked to expectations. He said perhaps 10-15 years ago the Village experienced changes to setbacks, fencing, tear downs, lot sizes, etc., as a reaction to redevelopment in the Village. Eventually the Village arrived at a set of redevelopment regulations that are still in place today, and they expect this to occur with regard to stormwater as well without causing more harm than good. He said staff and the Council continue to take input from all the residents of the community and he is glad to see so many people present at this meeting. He then asked for Council feedback on staff's report and feedback from the development community meetings.

Commissioner Barnett expressed concern that the proposed ordinance has a misalignment of costs and benefits. It strikes him that the cost or burden of public infrastructure improvements is being placed on private property. Storage requirements are above and beyond what is required now. In many cases he thinks they would be forcing a property owner to improve to such a degree that they would be improving the entire neighborhood, which is a burden beyond what he sees as the goal. The problem goes beyond surface nuisance runoff. Another thing that gives him pause is that there is a stormwater utility, however there is a misalignment between this concept and how the utility is being charged to the residents. There is a disconnect between building and development and assessing stormwater utility rates. He said that many people have said to him over the years to just build the stormwater system that the Village needs. In 11 years the Village has done $30 million and 60 projects on stormwater. The whole project is decades long to achieve, at a cost of hundreds of millions of dollars. The question now is what can be done in the interim to prevent things from getting worse.

Commissioner White asked staff to display the slide from the October 10 presentation of the administrative burden. 

Commissioner Barnett noted that the impervious area has changed in the last ten years. Changes in the impervious area can negatively impact neighbors. He said that many events cause impervious areas that are not addressed by the proposed ordinance. He asked staff to review what's occurred over the last decade and how many of the events would not be included in the draft ordinance.

Mr. Fieldman said the growth in total impervious area since January 2013 is an increase of about four million square feet, or 3.7%.  Staff also looked at the distribution of permit types over the last two years, and those contemplated under this draft ordinance have increased impervious area by about 230,000 square feet. Other permit types including sheds, patios, and decks have increased by about 141,000 square feet. Not all permits are covered under staff's draft ordinance.

Commissioner White then referred to chart presented at the October 10 meeting. He reviewed how they got to this evening's discussion. An objective engineering conclusion is that on-site detention is the most effective way to be sure that development doesn't affect neighbors, and it is also the most expensive. He asked developers to comment on this if they think the figures and concept is wrong. The question becomes whether it is worth the price to turn to on-site detention. One of the objections is the inability to connect if there is no public system nearby.

Mr. Fieldman said that the phrase "with an outlet nearby to a public system" is what is important.

Commissioner White continued that the Village then has a decision to make regarding whether to regulate on-site detention for residential lots. He received many emails regarding maximum impervious area as an alternate route. He said putting in on-site detention will be expensive. He doesn't feel he has enough data at this time to make a decision.

Mayor Tully said when they had the conversation it was assumed that on-site detention would be effective. The question of whether it will actually work, given cost considerations, has to be studied more closely. If 40% don't work, then they have had an expensive project that doesn't work. They need more information to determine whether it is really worth it.

Commissioner White reiterated that these are the choices. If we are saying "it's not worth it," we are saying that there is not much we can do.

Mayor Tully noted that staff's review says up to 40% of the solutions won't work, which gives him pause. They need further conversation. He is not suggesting that there is no solution.

Commissioner Barnett interjected that this is not an easy decision. The Council has recognized this problem for five years. They have to try and re-focus on the goal, which is not simply detention. He sees the goal as trying to reduce the pain on other's property caused by development. Finding a way to stay focused is the point. The question of impervious area is an important consideration. His intentions do not necessarily align with the idea that interior work or dollar-value-based work would be triggers.

Commissioner Waldack said there are competing interests everywhere. He spoke of the properties on flood plains, LPDAs, purchasing property on flood plains, etc. Maybe the answer is not total detention, but rather to do no harm. Maybe if you keep things the same that would be a solution for some areas.

Mr. Fieldman spoke to the topic of detention, saying that staff looked to find a way to capture the runoff caused by a myriad of factors. There are four general factors that could happen to a site and reduce the effectiveness of the required improvements. One is the amount and the location of the impervious areas. Secondly is the amount and location of sump pump discharge. Thirdly there is a change in topography, the grading of a site. And finally the change in compaction of soil caused by heavy construction equipment.  The Stormwater Oversight Committee in their review addressed many varieties of causes. If you can effectively detain it, you should do so.  If you cannot effectively detain it, look at these four factors.

Mayor Tully said that having many tools available is effective-keeping the tools that do work, and adding to them for those that do not work. It would seem that taking off the table those tools that don't work makes sense and is worth it.

Commissioner White said it is hard to impose on-site detention requirements on properties that cannot connect to public systems easily, and that won't drain. To require it where you have a public system readily available is still a challenge. He thinks the maximum impervious area regulation needs to be further explored, which is the 3rd item on the October 10 list.

Commissioner Earl commented that the key is the toolbox in terms of what is the best and the most reasonable tool for the site.

Mayor Tully noted that every property might be a unique situation.

Commissioner Barnett noted that none of this will happen without a cost. The question is who bears the cost and what the rate is going to be. He said no one has suggested since the discussions began that there should be full on-site detention. It is an extremely complicated challenge.

Commissioner Walus commented that the 60%/40% gives her pause given the effectiveness noted by staff's report. She pointed out that they are there to represent the residents and they need to do something. She is looking forward to what the people present at the meeting have to say.

1. Mark Cosenza, 4609 Seeley, said he is a member of the EDC board, but was not representing them. He commented that he built a home and put a basin in his back yard, which fills up and does not drain. He knew that he was in a low-lying area-an LPDA. Mr. Cosenza said he spent a lot of money on something that does not work, and doesn't want anyone else in the community to have to go through that. He has a fundamental issue with requiring detention on every redevelopment/addition and putting the public utility burden on individual homeowners. Homeowners would also be required to maintain those basins, and he would definitely caution against this. If they were to go with the system with 60% success, it would still bring down home values because of the additional cost.

2. Dave Matthias said he has been a builder in the Village since 1999, and he does not see on-site detention as the solution. The Village has always had a stormwater and flooding problem. He said that the 60%/40% figure is erroneous. The actual numbers are 80%/20% or 90%/10% based on his experience. The reason on-site detention doesn't work is because of the clay soil. Mr. Matthias said that the proposed ordinance would devastate the building community in this town. South of 63rd Street there are no problems and they would have to put in a system that is not necessary. They have a modern stormwater infrastructure. He suggested the Village maintain the existing system, which hasn't happened since 2006. A consultant prepared the 2006 report and that report needs to be followed. The Village roads are impervious surface as well and have to be taken into consideration. The Village's infrastructure has been neglected.

Commissioner White said this is the first really good explanation he's heard as to why an on-site detention system not immediately connected to the public system might appear to work; however, it is only because it is flowing through an underground seam onto a neighboring lot. He asked if those same comments would apply to an on-site system directly connected to a municipal water main.

Mr. Matthias said that the Council has received more erroneous information. Just because there is a storm sewer in front of the house doesn't mean the bottom of the sewer is adequate. Mr. Matthias said that whenever a pipe is replaced in a street the pipe size should be increased to a 6' pipe with a restrictor that ties in. The cost is insignificant to the overall effect it has on the problem. He said the Village should begin the work so that maybe his children will benefit from the work done now. He thinks they are having a knee-jerk reaction that will be devastating to the Village, and perhaps they should give consideration to establishing a Stormwater District, which would be a taxing body similar to the Sanitary District.

Mayor Tully thanked Mr. Matthias for his perspective. He said that a lot of money was spent on that plan in 2006, and more funds would still be needed to follow through on that report. The Mayor and Commissioner Barnett asked Mr. Matthias to leave his original written report.

3. Dave Grecco, former employee of the Village, said he considers himself to be a stormwater engineer, and he helped formulate the Master Plan in 2006. He said that Mr. Fieldman does a great job of conveying information. Mr. Greco said the Village could impose a fee and collect a fee and incorporate it into stormwater management. This would allow the Village to earn FEMA credits. The options to consider are neighborhood detention and piping, as well as side yard swales. He noted that any new building has to follow County regulations.


4. John Economides, 5206 Cumnor, said that in 1983 there was a huge flood, and again in 2012 it was worse, even with improvements that were made. He spoke about the impact of deeper basements. He thinks they need to think more three-dimensionally rather than two-dimensionally.

5. Rich Kulovany, 6825 Camden, noted that the whole area has problems. He spoke about the efforts in Chicago that alleviate some problems for a somewhat longer period. Chicago will look at local areas next. He recommended bringing experts in to look at this.

6. Jamie Rutter, 5401 Carpenter, expressed concern about the definition of a major addition. The cost will become prohibitive. She asked whether the Village will consider ways to help homeowners such as exemptions to those who add permeable surfaces, trees, etc.

Mayor Tully said that they have discussed the idea of credits under the stormwater utility.

7.   Tom Garritano, 4600 Oakwood, thanked Commissioner Barnett for helping the neighbors understand this issue.  He said that he supports the ordinance, but it is belated and it does not go far enough.  He showed photos of a home near Middaugh and Chicago and a home on Linscott with a concrete basketball court.  He said property values are diminishing.

8. Joyce Economides, 5206 Cumnor, said she has lived there since 1981.  She said that stopping development would work.  Many decisions are made on speculation.  She encouraged Council to ask people who are dealing with this.  She discussed water tables, flooding, swales, lot size, etc.  She said it is important to look at this long-term and to stop development.  We are losing absorbable land.  She urged the Council to first do no harm.  Ms. Economides said that in the past a Council member offered to contact her, but never did. 

Mayor Tully invited Ms. Economides to contact any Council member.

9. Jenny Garst, 5230 Farrar Court, said tonight's conversation is disheartening.  She agrees that experts should be consulted.  The key point is to do no harm. She urged Council to slow down development and asked for an interim regulation to do no harm.

Mayor Tully said that this is a process.  Some elements should be kept and we need to steer away from those that did not work.

10. Kristine Hocking, 4936 Montgomery, said she is a stormwater engineer and also has flooding in her backyard.  She suggested looking at short-term and long-term solutions.  In terms of short-term, she spoke of sump pump connections to a storm sewer.  She also spoke of maximum impervious lot coverage.  She said overland flood paths can be blocked by fences, sheds, etc.  She said the stormwater utility is a great tool.  She noted that the money available in the cost-sharing program is not enough.

11. Mr. Matthias said this ordinance will not correct the problems discussed tonight.  This is a band-aid approach. 

Mayor Tully said this endeavor was born out of a desire to address future problems.  Council and staff will continue to work on this challenge.

Commissioner White said he would like to see the impact of increased setbacks and maximum impervious areas.  He thinks that on-site detention without immediate connection to a public system may cause more harm than good.

Commissioner Waldack asked staff to review ideas discussed tonight and address them.  The theme he heard was do no harm.   He does not want to create more problems.

Commissioner Barnett said the Village has been at this issue for a long time.  Decisions are made with an engineering aspect.  He said it is important to think about preserving the work that has been done.

Mayor Tully this item is for discussion only at this time.  He said he was grateful for all the resident input.

Mr. Fieldman noted that a number of consultants and professional staff have studied this matter over a number of years and staff will continue to work on this issue. 

12. Adjournment

Mayor Tully asked for a motion to adjourn.

Motion:  Commissioner White moved to adjourn.  Commissioner Waldack seconded the motion.

Mayor Tully declared the motion carried by voice vote and the meeting adjourned at 9:54 p.m.